Hi Vera!
With all due respect: I am disappointed over your last article that you sent me. In this article you “tell” more than you actually want.
You can be sure that anyone else -except- what you read about the different methods of learning. Therefore, in this regard, “teaching” -to put it mildly- unsuitable. To put myself at the role of someone who “knows everything” and therefore the other students. And although we certainly have the same student in a foreign language. Do you really think that the methods of learning you already “know everything”?
That you are not the one who “knows everything” as to prove itself. For example, your assertion “I think less then 25 percent up to a maximum of 30 percent” does not stand serious examination. If this was your argument is accurate, this would mean that in your “Vocabulary” list of 10,000 known words only 3000 words (30%) of those that are already in the status of the 4th. Personally, I am sure that when you clear the situation inverse is true. So at least 70% of words already in the status 4, or at least there would be. Otherwise, this would mean that the “Vocabulary” you to loading only new words, but can not teach it. “LingQ of the day” is drawn exclusively from the words of your “Vocabulary” list.
With two different mother tongue (German, Slovenian) is really difficult to communicate in English (foreign language). Misunderstandings is here inevitable, completely understandable. Especially in the beginning then when one is practically a beginner. To disturb the fact that to bee scandalized in secondary issues. So instead of written content but on how it has succeeded doing so. Apparently it was your purpose to conceal something completely different.
Allusion in the style of “may I ask you if you use a tool like Google Translate to create your postings?” says also that the very know. Perhaps even you use this option. If you to pretend that in your “Vocabulary” list only 30% of words that are in status 4 is even necessary. However, I agree with you: compilers usually cause a lot of really bad translations.
I hope you that bit more “hard” article does not blame you too much. Personally, this is highly appreciated. Even so, because you proved hard worker, you are real plodding.
Regarding the status 4 issue, I think it’s as simple as this - it varies. I can’t predict which words will show up tomorrow, the day after tomorrow and in a week. The amount of words I “know” today may differ from what I remember tomorrow, even if the very same words show up. The most important thing, in my opinion, is not to put too much trust in the flashcards tool, but instead review the words once (or twice), and let the vocabulary sink in. Maybe a majority of the words I save today will appear in my next text; and if so, I might upgrade them another level. No big deal.
For me, it doesn’t take 15 minutes to go through the daily LingQs, rather just a couple of minutes. I know pretty instantly if I have even the slightest idea of the meaning, or if it’s totally blank.
I don’t always understand your posts either - are you saying that:
- there are too many status 4 words in your daily emails
- you learn the words too quickly (in which case they tend to show up again among the daily LingQs)
- the tool should work in a completely different manner
- all of the above
- something else?
A month ago there was a member who reviewed the recently saved LingQs until all were moved to level 4 (which I think is detrimental, unless one has a photographic memory - for most people, I dare say that things must sink in, over time). If this (review all words until status 4 is reached) is something that you do, you may want to consider going more slowly. You will not get annoyed by the daily LingQs, you will have plenty of opportunities to see yellow words in the upcoming texts (=reminding you that they are “old friends”) and so on.
But to each, his/her own.
I agree with Jeff. It’s better to learn the vocabulary over time. Sometimes even when I know a word I’ll give the wrong answer on purpose so that I can see the word repeated a few more times again in future.
I agree with Jeff.
The status increases when you got the word two times correct in reviewing the flashcards. It is important to stop if the row starts the third time. Then only words appears that you didn’t know the first or second time. If you continue until no words appears, the status of all words will increase.
I met Sonne at the London Language Show today and we had an enthusiastic chat about many things.
One thing she mentioned was that she seldom encounters yellow highlighted words in her new texts at LingQ. My new texts are full of yellow words. The difference is that I rarely move words to known. I only go through my LingQ emails once. I wonder if we should not allow known words to stay yellow. I find I the yellow highlighted words really help me learn.
Hi Steve, known words have a thin punctated line. I think this is fine. So you can see blue words (new words), yellow words (not learned), words with a punctated line (learned) and known words (words without a LingQ).
As a result of following this thread and my chat with Steve in London today I have decided to move my category 4 words down one level. I shall also give myself more time before moving new words up to “learned” and am curious how, or whether, this will affect my overall progress. It will certainly throw a spanner into the statistics…
Hi Jeff, Vera, Cantotango!
Jeff wrote: “I do not always understand your posts either - are you saying that.” Here then you write about their findings, you to put the arguments! So, there was no misunderstanding. What was really your true purpose? Vera and Cantotango acknowledge this.
However, I’ll respond to the confusion, your “misunderstanding”. You write:
“* There are too many status 4 words in your daily emails”: again pronounced that this is meant solely in connection with the activities of member statistics. You re-read my second article in this issue. We’ll crystal clear that the repeat -consolidation of foreign words- necessary.
“* You learn the words too quickly (in Which case they Tend to show up again among the daily LingQs)”: how do you find that the words I teach too? On what basis do you to infer ? To win a word is not essential how long is painted, colored yellow, but rather on the number of repetitions and still other factors. After that famous phrase: many, many times. Loop (consolidation) of words can be implemented in several ways. Therefore, this is done every individual in its own way. By the way: I’m surprised that you have not yet determined that the words from “Vocabulary” that are already in the status 4 in subsequent lessons underlined (a punctated line). Touch the word a cursor to open the yellow box. You can quickly realize the importance of this English word. Without browsing “Vocabulary”. This is the same as that used flashcard: unlimited times. Or then you need “LingQ of the day” for the consolidation of ideas, loop the words?
“* The tool should work in a completely different manner”: it is obvious that, when learning a foreign language-in-various levels using different approaches. I agree with you: but each his / her own. Beginner is mainly focused on increasing your vocabulary. Therefore, more listening and reading and is a minor in writing and speaking. Tutors are your focused mainly on writing and speaking and only a minor increase in vocabulary. As far as I’m in 4 months failed to identify the learning LingQ all defined very indicative, not too explicit. More or less everything is left to the ingenuity of the individual: perhaps deliberately. If I look a little according to the statistics you realize that all three really use the old -but unfortunately- has survived the drill method. All three together are statistically -in more than one year- read (824.000 words). This was circa 38% less than I do in 4 months (1,335.000 words). All modern methods of learning a foreign language is base on the listening and reading. I’ll very happy if we’ll definitely defining what it was like under the “work in a completely different manner.”
And no offense, please.
I look forward to hearing from you on this Sanne. I must say that I find the yellow highlighting a stronger visual trigger than the faint underline, and therefore am in no hurry to move words to known. To me the ken statistics are the total known words and the lingqs created. But to each his or her own. There is lots of room at LingQ for individual learners to follow their own inclinations.
Clarification, which shall not be ashamed nor Salamon, Steve. Anyone who knows, this knows.
For measuring your learning, I think people should focus more on listening and reading than on word count. The number of times you listen and read an item with attention and understanding, the more you will learn. I find this a much more plausible metric than long discussions on the validity of the word count or status of learned words etc. The LingQs are there to support your listening and reading not vice versa.
Words are more or less arbitrary marks on a surface. They are relatively easy to count, so this site uses them as a guage of progress. But LingQ (Steve and Mark) consistently assert that they are best viewed as an indicator of progress, not to be taken as scientifically accurate… As Steve says, reviewing LingQs is a way to make you brain more sensitive to the more important work of listening and reading.
dooo, you’re right. And I am focus on listening and reading.
However I noticed that sth didn’t work how it was supposed to.
I’m graduated in mathematics and computer science so I like when 2+2=4.
When I do a project of sth, I’m glad when the users give me a feedback how it works.
Otherwise I won’t get know that sth doesn’t work properly.
I’m sure there are a lot of more important tasks to do to improve LingQ but I just think it’s useful to know when sth doesn’t work. And that’s all.
Tone,
I really had no idea if my points were anywere close to what you meant - I just took a few wild guesses using my “language intution”.
If one regularly learns the recent words “too quickly” and get them moved to level 4, they will indeed show up among the daily LingQs for a couple of days. And those will take some extra (“unnecessary”) time to go through… If that’s what’s annoying you (yes, I’m still not sure what your main criticism is…) then please don’t review the words that often, or ignore the flashcard tool completely.
I’m very well aware of the dotted status 4 words in the texts. Of course I check those which I have forgotten. I still appreciate highlighted words in the texts, since they remind me of words that I haven’t yet “fully” learned.
As many have said - read and listen for most of the time. Use the flashcard tool sparingly, especially if it annoys you that much. Don’t do anything you find uninteresting, time-consuming or counter-productive.
I see no problem on using flash cards. For me, it works. I dont think there is a perfect system out there to learn a new language, that is why we need to make the best of what we have and add our own methods and variations to study and learn. For instance, when I read an article or take a new lesson, I highlight the words I don’t know. I listen to the audio and take a brake. The follwoing day, I go thru the flash cards three times. The words that I feel comfortable, I go thru them one more time so that I can place them as “learned”. the ones I don’t feel comfortable, i will write them on a personal notebook, i will look for their meaning at: www.wordreference.com this is a dictionary that not only tells me the meaning but gives me the different word variations and several examples in how and when to use them. Believe me, this extra work and effort, makes me put more attention to these words and thus easier to understand and learn them. Finally, I go back to the lesson where I found them and would read the entire lesson again. You would be surprise how easier is to understand 100% of what you are reading and remembering all the words you just learned. Do we need to change scores and/or ask why two or three words or phrases are not counted? I don’t think so. As long as we are making progress, to me that’s what is more important.
Hi Jeff,
It’s ever really learns a new word “too quickly” (and get them moved to level 4) may be to convince exhausted. The fact is that the method LingQ yet possible to build, simplify, improve. Or, as Steve says: “There is lots of room at LingQ for individual Learners to follow their own inclinations.” To summarize: the objective (to learn the words) to us is the same, only achieve it in different ways, with different approaches. What is the individual better, faster, more efficient you the individual himself. Words with your words: “Do not do anything you find uninteresting, time-consuming or counter-productive”.
I know this is an old posting. And I know that statistic is not the most important thing, although I think if you offer functions you should do your best to make them work properly. For me, this problem still exists and I’m not sure if it is on your to-do-list or not.
Today I reviewed LingQs using the link in the LingQ of the day email. A lot of LingQs changed from status 3 to 4 in the flashcards.
19 LingQs were single words. They were counted as learned LingQs.
37 LingQs were phrases. They were not counted.
This problem occurs only with Internet Explorer! After this experiment I tested it for Firefox and it worked!
Can you please look into this problem? It is not a solution for me not to use IE. Be aware that a lot of people all over the world still use IE. I cannot imagine that your solution is to suggest people to use only FF when they work with LingQ.
I understand that it sometimes takes time to solve problems, but I’m not sure if you still have seen this as an issue!
Right, well I use Firefox and I move my words up to status 4 in the vocabulary list, I Ddon’t use flashcards. I find that 100 words learned increases my known words by maybe only 50. I’ve stopped worrying about this very much, because I found it made my head hurt. But it has happened all through the 2 years I have been using LingQ and it is still happening.
Mark has explained the system to me several times, but that made my head hurt too, so instead I use the explanation that “it works by magic, just like the Tooth Fairy”.
Helen, I think the functions should work in the same way with IE and FF. Don’t you think so?
We are aware of some issues with the statistics and we are trying to resolve them. Vera, it isn’t really a browser issue because I don’t have the problems you have in IE when I use it. So, it is only some IE users that have these issues. This makes it difficult to track them down. However, we are aware of the problems and we are trying to resolve them all in time.
Thank you Mark, I wasn’t sure if it was on your list.