If I had to estimate Steve’s CEFR level in each of his languages, I would say:
(I don’t know enough about his Czech, Korean and German to make any guess about those.)
I don’t know whether Steve would agree with any of my estimates?
Does anyone else want to estimate where they (or sombody else) stands on the CEFR scale?
For myself, I would guess:
For myself, I’d estimate:
English C2 (on a good day!)
German C1 (whenever I’ve spent the last few days reading in it)
Italian B1 (it’s rusty now - used to be solid B2)
There is also this detailed version of CEFR’s descriptions, explaining how you are able to use your separate skills (listening, reading, spoken interaction, spoken production, writing) on each level: http://bit.ly/zybmRf
This particular one is especially good for self-assessment!
I have difficulties rating myself in any other target language than English (~C1). My skills in other languages vary a lot. I can read and understand spoken German/Spanish way above my productive level (but I can survive if I’m on holiday). I’ve read books in both languages but couldn’t write a post even as brief as this one without errors.
@jeff_lindqvist So, you may assess your skills separately. The link is above
On the CEFR scale I would deem Benny to be:
My prediction for his Chinese after three months: A2-
I would guess for myself:
Russian: B2 (still actively studying)
Ukrainian: A1-A2 (just dabbled a bit with it) / B1 (reading knowledge, because of its similarity with Russian)
Japanese: A1 (see above)
@Rank: Anhand eines kurzen Videos mit (eventuell) vorher abgesprochenen Fragen und Themen werden wir Bennys Sprachniveau leider sowieso nicht beurteilen können.
Btw: I would estimate that Benny’s German is on a good B2-level.
Obtained certificates indicate that
English B1-B2 (TOEIC 730-860)
Chinese reading-writing C1 (HSK 5th) oral B1-B2 (HSK intermediate oral)
French B2 (DELF B2)
But tell me the truth, my speaking ability is very low, maybe lower intermediate level.
read-B2 (I can guess the meaning of my favorite articles even if unknown characters or words appear in newspapers. I can understand almost every article if I use dictionaries.)
write-C1 (I can write characters by hand and I manage to chat with native speakers quite fast on Skype without problem.)
listen B1-B2 (I understand films or news with Chinese subtitles. )
speak A2 (I can talk with native speakers, using active words. When they speak unfamiliar words , I can manage to ask them some questions.)
I will try to pass DALF (C1) in French and advanced oral test in Chinese (C1-C2) this year, HSK 6th(C2) next year in order to encourage myself.
It is difficult to evaluate ourselves, because our skills are not even in all areas of the language. Furthermore we improve when we are put in situations where we have to use the language a lot. Languages get a little rusty with misuse but recover very quickly when the occasion to use them arises, at least that is my experience.
So in a way, the following represents my potential, even if I cannot always perform at these levels. In most cases I read better than I speak, especially in Czech and Russian, where I have had little chance to speak. I can read the Czech newspaper with a little difficulty, and am reading a book on Czech history for the second time and enjoy the experience in that there not enough unknown words to make it unenjoyable. Speaking in Czech is another matter, but when I start speaking more, I am confident I will improve quickly.
Steve is one pretty mean dude, Imyirtseshem. But let’s not forget that Sheriff Simcott lives in this town too - and then there’s the pistol packin’ preacher Rev Arguelles…
Some folks say that they are even quicker on the draw than Killer-Kaufmann! ;-0
(But as for Bandito Benny, he doesn’t even dare show his face in the saloon - but instead skulks around out in Fool’s Gold Gulch!)
I don’t know about the good prof, but Torbyrne and Lucca beat me, and in sheer numbers of languages, Moses is way up there. Don’t forget that I am a little older and have lived in a few places. And of course it is not a competition. Do what you like doing. If you enjoy the journey you are less concerned about the destination, in fact the destination never comes.
No, of course it’s not a competition…
I think to those who are winning, it’s even more of a competition.
What’s the prize in language learning, though? I think it’s different for each person.
If that’s how you feel, Imyirtseshem, there’s only one thing to be done: strap on your shootin’ irons, ride over to Steve’s house at highnoon and call him out!
In this case, the slow runner is probably pretty satisfied if he makes any progress. It’s only when he compares himself to others that he feels inadequate.
Solution? Simple. Don’t compare yourself to others. Enjoy your own journey. It’s not a race, as not everyone starts at the same time, at the same point or wih the same level of experience.
In the immortal words of Commander Worf: “If winning is not important, then why do we keep score?”
I’d give myself a solid C1 in Italian, even if on a bad day I may perform at a B2 level.
For Spanish, things get funky. I read at at least B2, listen and write at B1, but speak at A2 if I am lucky.
@odiernod: “…I’d give myself a solid C1 in Italian, even if on a bad day I may perform at a B2 level.”
I think that’s an important point. The level we have in a language probably has a “high tide” and a “low tide” depending on the amount of recent exposure that we’ve had.
And there are other factors too, such as fatigue, good/bad-day-ness, number of whisky-sours recently consumed, etc… I once went into an oral exam almost entirely three sheets to the wind (And I did pretty well too!)
Well, I’ve been working slowly but steadily at Russian for 6 years here and elsewhere (give or take the odd break to have a baby), and I’m about B1+. I read here about people reaching B2 in 2 or 3 years, and I realise I’m far from being the fastest learner in the class.
On the other hand, I could have spent the last 6 years just wiping noses and not have learned any Russian at all.
What I HAVE learned in this time, I hope, is how to learn a language, so that it will be a bit easier for me to learn Japanese.
The more I think about the CEFR, the more I think how big is the gap between B1 and B2. It seems to me that it’s at least twice the work to get from B1 to B2 than it is to get from scratch to B1.
What does everyone else think about making the B2 milestone?