…or can it come later after lots of comprehensible input
Speaking is needed to speak. Listening is needed to comprehend. Reading is needed to read.
I agree. Do you think early speaking with mistakes etc is a good route to take or would you rather wait until the language had clarified in your head before speaking
EVERYONE speaks with mistakes! Children do when they start out and adult learners do too at all levels. Even native speakers make mistakes in their own language! The major difference is that children are not inhibited or self-conscious about their mistakes (and don’t even know they’re making them) while adults are often inhibited because they DO know another way of expressing themselves which is in their native language. Because of that other option, adults generally don’t practice speaking as much as would be helpful even though practice is exactly what they need! By contrast, children do get a lot of practice and thus improve because they don’t hold themselves back. Do what’s comfortable for you. To help you move to speaking more quickly, read the passages out loud on LingQ to yourself. Practice talking to yourself out loud with whatever vocabulary you are learning whenever possible – e.g., taking a shower, walking when no one is around, when you’re driving and stuck in traffic, etc. If you routinely speak to yourself out loud, it will be that much easier when you eventually have a conversation with someone else.
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It can come later. Speak when you’re ready. You will need to practice speaking to get GOOD at speaking but input is definitely the first step in order to be able to mutter something.
You can even maintain a language at a high level even if you almost never speak it!
I probably speak Spanish once a month and it simply takes 5-10 minutes to get warmed up (mostly to lose the accent) since I listen to about 1 hour of material every single day.
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whines about LingQ
Spends his life on LingQ
nice
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There’s speaking and there’s conversing. I start speaking in the very beginning in order to properly learn pronunciation and the alphabet. If I don’t do that first, every time I read something I’ll be reinforcing incorrect pronunciation.
Conversation is a different story. You can wait as long as you want without fear of fossilizing errors. After experimenting, I’ve found that I prefer to begin conversing after about 3 months. I tend to get really anxious to converse if I wait longer than that.
There are 4 parts of the language study:
- reading
- listening
- speaking
- writing
The most learners study languages in this order.
But every new stage is difficult at first and it is impossible without making a lot of mistakes.
But if you continue making efforts the number of mistakes will be reduced quite soon.
As a language teacher I can say that people who are not afraid of making mistakes start speaking much earlier than the people who would like to speak without mistakes.
That’s why the students from Spain and Italy start to speak earlier than the students from Switherland or Sweden as well as the children speak a new language earlier and better than those adults who are too embarrassed to look like a child.
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Where did i whine about LingQ ? I like LingQ. I just don’t use it because of the amount of website errors it has.
Please just don’t respond in that hideous pretend French that you speak in Canada.
I personally don’t believe in ‘fossiliation’. People who speak with ‘fossilised’ mistakes are adult learners who have gotten to a level where they stop improving because they don’t need to. There are tonnes of examples of non-natives who started off speaking a bit ropey but due to continued effort applied to improving their speech have slowly brought it up to a better and better level. That Katja girl from DFE on youtube is one example. As is the ‘Get Germanized’ guy. They have videos of them speaking English from like 10 years ago and they sound as German as German comes. Now they speak fantastically well, especially her - she is better than most natives.
As long as you’re paying attention to what you’re saying it’s quite possible to develop a good command of a language whilst actively speaking it. It just requires continued and long-term effort.
“Where did i whine about LingQ ? I like LingQ. I just don’t use it because of the amount of website errors it has.”
You just did and usually go on about how cool you are because you found a free equivalent.
“Please just don’t respond in that hideous pretend French that you speak in Canada.”
You need to learn more than 10 phrases in order to judge an accent. Aren’t you living in France? Why can’t you still speak French fluently? Sad!
By the way, don’t you have a kid? I personally am not big on British English, but to use that as an argument was probably acceptable in primary school…grow up.
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I read French fluently because i spend most of my time reading. I don’t work in France because i have tonnes of money (built up a property portfolio in England) and don’t need to work. You will never have had responsibilities like me because you’re not a man. Real men have wives kids and their own houses. You have none of those things because you are a globetrotting man-child.
If you weren’t, you would know that it’s hard to swan off and speak the language all day when you have responsibilities. And that is the reason i don’t ‘speak’ French fluently. And it doesn’t bother me. If i were a man-child like you i would simply go into town all day and sit in some bar and learn it like that.
I will speak French fluently one day, but that can wait until after i’m done with my various current projects and actually have time to dedicate to the language outside of reading and watching TV.
And when i do i’ll be fluent in a few months due to how much passive knowledge i have in my head.
Is that a good enough explanation as to why i’m better than you ?
You’re welcome. Thanks for coming along. See yourself out.
PS, saying i use an alternative to LingQ and giving the reasons why hardly constitutes ‘whining’. Maybe you should learn what words actually mean before you come and laugh at someone elses language ability ?
“Is that a good enough explanation as to why i’m better than you ?”
Calling people half your age “man child” and then going on about how busy you are does not help your argument, since you would never find the time to post nonsense on a language forum if you truly were that busy. You also would not give advice to other users when you cannot speak even 1 other language than English!
By the way, I wrote that you were whining because other users are able to intelligently criticize LingQ while you are whining about it. “Too expensive. Bugs. Found something way better”. You sound like my female classmates.
Have fun spreading your ignorance and giving poor advice to other users.
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“Real men have wives kids and their own houses.”
Poor Pope he’s not a Real man. ˇ︿ˇ
What’s the free alternative?
If you learn to read and listen, you are learning the language. To learn to speak you need to speak. The more you speak, the better you will speak. As to when you start speaking, it doesn’t matter and is a matter of taste. I have mostly just listened and read in my Greek learning. I am in Greece and having no difficulty communicating, in fact people are amazed at my vocabulary, and how correctly I use the language. The more I speak, and continue to read and listen, (which I will do) the better I will do. Just a matter of how we choose to get started in the language. I prefer to build up my familiarity in the language first.
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Wow.
You already made history Mr.Steve, now I think you are making something else that terminologists are still thinking of as to what to call it.
Half my age ? You’re 15 ?
Google it.