Creating Lingqs: it is worth the time?

[arguros]

Hi,

I am writing to ask you what is, in your experience, the long-term advantage of creating Lingqs. I am a beginners and I am not planning to use the SRS.

For a 20mins audio it takes me at least 10 minutes to go through the unknow words list.

I am wondering now, is this time worth it? I could use the same time just to go ahead and read more text and get more inputs,

I am now considering marking all the world as known at the beginning and then focus only on creating the minimum lingqs I need.

I don’t feel I need to look up every single word, i.e. to create a Lingq for it, to comprehend the text.

What do you think? Do you have any tips for me?
My main coincent is that creating Lingqs for all the unknown word is a big waste of time in the long run.

Many thanks for your help

[Obsttorte]

As you always can create LingQ’s later on if necessary, I see no reason why you shouldn’t stick to your approach if it is working.
Creating a LingQ for every single word is probably really not worth the effort. However, this also depends on how good the suggestions made when you click on a word are.
There are also users who just read a sentence, compare it to the translation (given or ai based) and move on if they got the approximate meaning correct. In some instances they may also create one or to LingQ’s for very specific words, but that’s it.
In the end it really depends on you and what works best for you. Try out different approaches and see what works. And altering the workflow from time to time is also a good way to spice things up imho. Just because you do it in a certain way now doesn’t imply you have to do it like this forever.

[nfera]

You can turn on auto-lingQ in the settings, which means it auto-selects the top definition upon clicking the word. I’m not sure how this will change over the coming updates with the introduction of AI Contextual Definitions, whether they’ll make this definition auto-lingQ or what, but it’ll save you the time of having to select the ‘most appropriate’ definition. You can also use one of @roosterburton’s extensions to mass auto-lingQ the entire lesson, if that suits your fancy.

A benefit of not letting words you don’t actually know move to Known is that when you are selecting appropriate lessons, the number of New Words and lingQs vs the number of Known words actually has some meaning.

[ericb100]

If you are spending a lot of time on each one, no, definitely not a good use of time-especially if you’re just creating a definition that someone else already offered. If the offered suggestion is close enough, just select the default and move on. If that meaning is no good, you can click on it and usually someone has given a better meaning, or the one that matches for what you want. Select it and move on. Only if there’s no definition could it be beneficial to create one…but honestly…probably not. It’s probably an uncommon word. I do tend to look these up, especially if sentence translation doesn’t give a satisfying meaning. In that case I’ll copy the sentence into chat gpt to explain it. My own personal preference, but doubtful if it will help in learning the language (again, it’s probably an uncommon word).

As suggested by nfera you could turn on auto lingq if you prefer.

The main benefit to LingQ is the ability to look up the words/sentence meaning quickly. The act of creating a Lingq definition is probably not beneficial in most cases.

You could try something that noxialisrex suggested one time and that’s to not look up a word unless you’ve seen it 3x. At that point you know it has some importance, at least in the context of the lesson or set of lessons (or across a bunch of varied lessons). I personally feel a need to look up most things…you could look it up, select the first option and move on…and only after 3x perhaps refine the definition or look closer at the meaning if the first selected option is not satisfactory.

I also work almost exclusively in sentence mode. I always show the sentence translation if I have questions on any word. Usually this presents a better meaning of the word in context.

[LeifGoodwin]

As stated above, do what works best for you.

I don’t create LingQs, as for me it takes too much time, and in general I prefer to learn words in context, not from a dictionary definition. Thus I harvest example phrases such as Tout ira comme sur des roulettes. If I don’t understand a word, I check the sentence translation.

I allow the system to gradually automatically mark words as known. It’s only a very rough estimate, but provides some feedback.

[davideroccato]

@arguros I have no idea what the best solution is.

I personally write a lot of lingqs and definitions. I also use LingQ to have my personal vocabulary every time I read. When I don’t need a personal vocabulary, I can read anywhere without needing LingQ. I write definitions for acronyms, historical periods, sometimes famous people, and so on. Occasionally I also integrate them in the notes.

I don’t do this all the time, only when I’m comfortable with the computer, because I write faster with a keyboard, and when I have more energy.

Recently, I’ve started using the vocabulary I have in LingQ when I’m reading on my computer outside of LingQ. This allows me to have my own definitions that I have already looked up.

I tend to reverse the process, instead of going faster, I go slower. I think that if I spend more time writing the definition, or seeing many different aspects of the same word, it will stick better in my mind. Instead of waiting 40 times before I get the meaning, I might be able to remember the word after just a few times. On average.

I don’t use the number of words read as the main metric, just as a casual reference to my daily work. I prefer the number of “known words” as a better indicator of my progress.

I don’t consider the time spent creating lingqs a waste of time, because I consider it an investment for future readings.

However, I’m not sure I’m doing anything right, because as we progress in our target language, we continue to refine and refine the way we study. At the end of the day, if you can measure yourself with practical results, so much the better. I am constantly refining my way of studying to become more effective and get better results.
I wish you the best of luck.

[arguros]

HI,
What do you mean by?

@LeifGoodwin

I allow the system to gradually automatically mark words as known

Pierpaolo

[arguros]

HI,
Thanks for the tips, I have activated the auto-lingq options, and it helps to be faster.
I tried the chrome extension, the free version, but it does not work for me at all.

[arguros]

Thanks to you all: @Obsttorte, @LeifGoodwin , @ericb100 , @davideroccato , @nfera

The bottom line is i need to keep using the app and see what works best for me!
I made a few changes to the settings to speed things up.

[LeifGoodwin]

My understanding is that you can configure it so that when you encounter a word twice, it will automatically mark it as known. In reality I sometimes learn a word on the first encounter, but usually it takes far more than two times. However, the automatic system provides a rough metric.

[nicolasbrunel]

Something I wanted to add. Creating Lingq is when I focus on a word. I look for its definition. I may read the definition in the target langague. I put some time into checking specificities of that word usage. It’s in Ukrainian. For instance, I put nominative form of a word. If it’s a verb, I indicate if the verb is perfective or imperfective. I add also perfective form if I encounter imperfective and imperfective form if I encounter perfective form. I may also find group of words which are interesting together a create a LingQ. But it’s true that with time I need to put less details as I can recognized more easily if a noun is masculin, feminin or neutral. My interest is not long term. It’s short term to add details I want to memorize together with the word.

For instance, it’s not obvious to recognize “гра” and “ігри” are the same word. So I will add nominative form “гра” when I find “ігри” so that I remember it’s the same word.

I agree that long term it has less importance. It really depends on the langague your are studying. Also LingQ creation is the limiting factor when you are reading.

Personnally I leave word I’m not interested blue and focus on what I’m interested and what can be guessed easily. For very long video, video which last one hour for instance, I mostly don’t stop the video and add LingQ only for the word I recognize. It’s to check my guess was rigth. Without that method, I cannot use video that long.

[jt23]

I don’t think creating LingQs is worth the time. I don’t think clicking 1-4-K is worth the time either.

Plus the LingQ philosophy of marking all blue words known at the end of a lesson is so stupid and user-hostile, that I don’t want to have anything to do with the whole scheme.

LingQ is so poorly designed and programmed that I don’t want to depend upon LingQ to keep track of anything. Nor do I care about the LingQ philosophy beyond using it as a convenient e-reader with dictionaries and audio.

I mark all blue words Known when I encounter them. I write the words I don’t know, including ones I have run into before, into my notebook with definitions I check from real dictionaries, not whatever stuff LingQ users pushed into the system. Likewise I note phrases and sentences I don’t understand into my notebook.

I review my notebook later. I can remember the words and phrases in the context because they are grouped together in my notebook.

I find that writing things down reinforces my learning in useful ways. I’ll bet I spell better than 95% of LingQ users too. Plus it’s very satisfying to see my collection of notebooks grow on my shelf.

Do what works for you.

[burro99900]

Personally, I don’t mark everything as known. I began a book that was very descriptive of a setting and at the beginning, I had no idea what most of the words(so a lot of lingQs were made) meant but since they were constantly used over and over, I began to make my lingQ lighter and than held off reading more chapters to go over previous chapter where there were 80-100 lingQs and managed to take down 20-8.
I highly recommend lingQs because they give you a heads up that a lesson has words that you didn’t recognize in the pass so you can look at them beforehand to get them in your head and try to mark them lighter or as known.
LingQs are not a waste of time and actually help to give more flavor to a sentences. if you understand the big picture of a lesson, great. If you want to know more descriptive words or verbs, keep making LingQs.
The more lingQs you make, you more you will see in new lessons so you’re be given more chances to come across old words that you might know, thus improving your passive vocabulary.

[nfera]

@davideroccato

I don’t consider the time spent creating lingqs a waste of time, because I consider it an investment for future readings.

I haven’t been spending much time on LingQ these days for this exact reason (that I do consider it a time waste). Some of your prompts last year in the “Is extensive or intensive reading faster for vocabulary acquisition?” thread together with some exploration on my own part led me to the conclusion that it is, at least for me. I’m keen on trying out the new AI Contextual Definitions with auto-lingQ turned on for Italian. I was having issues with low-frequency words having multiple definitions, so I would end up writing out my own definitions, which lowered how much I was reading. Hopefully, this is the solution to the issue on Android.

[davideroccato]

@nfera

(that I do consider it a time waste)

Yeah, I’m not sure about my current method either, but I follow the philosophy: “When the direction is unclear, stay the course”.

I have evolved and changed a lot in the way I study now. I also focus on only one language instead of four.

There’s also a common problem in Western society: we feel we have to do too much, too fast, and it’s never enough.

There is an aspect of looking up definitions that I like. It slows me down and helps me pay attention to the different aspects of the word. For example, a single word can be used as a noun, adjective, adverb, or verb, and I didn’t know that word at all. Maybe I thought I knew this word, and when I realize that it is so complex, I change my mind about it. I say something like, "Wow, I had no idea that this little word had so many possibilities.

But I don’t write all these definitions all the time. I really go with my gut.

I got caught up in the ultra-reading mentality - the fast-paced mentality - and realized that it’s better for my own brain health to slow down. By slowing down, I can better appreciate the sentence, focus on the spelling, focus on the concept, and so on.

I read less, yes, but I understand more, and I have more energy to keep up with the language with a variety of different resources throughout the day.

Sometimes I spend more time looking up a word on Wikipedia or talking about a word on ChatGPT than I do reading the book. Was that time wasted? Not really. It was just a different way of dealing with the language.

When I have more mental energy, I focus more, when I have less mental energy, I read more casually. I mix things up.

As you said, the way you did it was a waste of time for you, and that is the beauty of the learning process and why it is so difficult to create a standard for everyone. We have to tailor it to ourselves, our age, our busyness, the language we are targeting, and many other variables.

[LeifGoodwin]

@jt23

LingQ is so poorly designed and programmed that I don’t want to depend upon LingQ to keep track of anything. Nor do I care about the LingQ philosophy beyond using it as a convenient e-reader with dictionaries and audio.

The problem I have with LingQ (iOS app) is that bugs appear overnight in existing functionality. The current bug is inability to import YouTube videos. I think the people who call the shots are language specialists, not software engineers.

@jt23

I mark all blue words Known when I encounter them. I write the words I don’t know, including ones I have run into before, into my notebook with definitions I check from real dictionaries, not whatever stuff LingQ users pushed into the system. Likewise I note phrases and sentences I don’t understand into my notebook.

I review my notebook later. I can remember the words and phrases in the context because they are grouped together in my notebook.

There are some well known polyglots who use that method.

@jt23

I find that writing things down reinforces my learning in useful ways. I’ll bet I spell better than 95% of LingQ users too. Plus it’s very satisfying to see my collection of notebooks grow on my shelf.

Do what works for you.

Some native French speakers have awful spelling.

[GMelillo]

@nfera

I haven’t been spending much time on LingQ these days for this exact reason (that I do consider it a time waste). Some of your prompts last year in the “Is extensive or intensive reading faster for vocabulary acquisition? ” thread together with some exploration on my own part led me to the conclusion that it is, at least for me. I’m keen on trying out the new AI Contextual Definitions with auto-lingQ turned on for Italian. I was having issues with low-frequency words having multiple definitions, so I would end up writing out my own definitions, which lowered how much I was reading. Hopefully, this is the solution to the issue on Android.

I’ve come more towards your position on this since the extensive/intensive reading discussion, though I haven’t changed the way I use LingQ. That’s mostly because at this point with Italian my threshold for allowing words to get put in the “known” bucket is low enough where I’m hardly doing much with my Italian reading except racking up words-read stats and collecting new verb forms of known stems that I haven’t seen yet.

That said, if a LingQ user wants to make any use of the known/LingQ distinction they need to interact with the platform to indicate what they know. I personally love the moving-words-to-known-on-page turn feature because it means I only interact with LingQ when I need information. If this AI-thing makes the LingQ auto-assign a good enough definition on one interaction with the platform per unknown word, I don’t see how they can make it much better.

[Dolu2k]

If it’s taking you ten minutes to read through the words that are unknown, you are likely reading something that is too hard for your current level. The language you’ve chosen should have some easier texts available if you adjust the level to just A1 only.

I typically read through an entire page, using context to determine what the unknown words mean and then review and create Linqs for whichever seem useful to know.

[gaoli]

I have always thought of LingQ as a collection of powerful tools, not as a specific method of language learning. Steve K uses some LingQ feature and also uses other resources. He uses a method that works well for him.

I think the link method (marking each word known or 4 levels of “partly known”) is an excellent tool. It is more flexible than Anki, but serves a similar purpose. If it is useful to you, then use it. If not, then don’t use it.

Personally I can’t use it. I rarely consider a word “known”:

A: I saw it yesterday, so I remember it. But what if I don’t see it for 2 weeks? Will I remember it? Maybe not.

B: I only saw the word in this mini-story. Will I recognize the word if I see it used by someone else, in some other way? With a different ending? With a different English translation? Maybe not.

C) It isn’t much use to mark several words “known”, and go back later and mark them “not known”. Been there. Done that.

But that’s just me and how I learn. Anyone else? Try it and see if it helps you.