A possible way to practice output

Open Forum
1

Hi, I’d like to get some thoughts on idea I had.

Some background first: I have been learning Spanish for the past 6 years or so. I started like many beginners with grammar books, apps, tutorials, etc. before discovering LingQ and other input based approaches based on Steve Krashen’s theories of language acquisition. At that point I switched to an almost exclusively input-based approach, listening and reading as much as possible. I have been doing for the past 2 years. I have been very pleased with the results and often find myself surprised by how much I can understand when listening to the news, reading books, listening to podcasts, etc. I am able to enjoy reading novels in Spanish pretty comfortably. I took an online test recently and it placed me at the C1 level. I thing that was an overestimation, but it was still interesting to see. I don’t really care about those tests that much and I don’t have any goals based on them. I just do them from time to time to get an idea of how I am developing.

However, I have to come to realize that my output has really suffered. Often I struggle to say even the most basic things and really have to think about the vocabulary and sentence structures that I have floating around my head. In some ways, I feel like my output has regressed back to a near beginner level.

I don’t get overly concerned about this as I know that if I understand the language then I will be able to produce it with practice. But, on the other hand, I also realize that at some point I need to actually DO that practice if I want to be able to produce output.

However, my schedule makes it really hard for me to arrange times to speak with language partners or attend meetups with any regularity. I do them as much as works for me, but I need more regular practice. (please don’t lecture me about ways to find time, trust me when I say that I have a great deal of experience in time management and I know what works for me.)

So, here is what I was thinking. If the LingQ lessons helped me so much with Spanish, why not flip the script? I am thinking about creating a profile in English (my native language) and working through the lessons trying to reproduce them in my target language (Spanish). If my language acquisition has been successful it seems like this would be a perfect way to start practicing using what I have acquired. If I can’t reproduce even the simplest level of LingQ exercises in my target language, then that would seem to say something about how successful input has been. I know that writing is not the same as speaking and I know that translation is not the same as producing language spontaneously. But surely, something is better than nothing, yes?

So, has anyone else tried this? Have you found it useful? I’d be interested in hearing thoughts.

A few more points to clarify why I am thinking about this approach as opposed to some other popular suggestions and acknowledgments of some pitfalls:

  1. I hate doing grammar exercises. I find them boring and tedious. Also, since they are usually based on isolated sentences they don’t really practice producing a sustained set of statements about a subject.

  2. I know I could just buy simple phrase books or other sources and just translate them, but I am already paying for LingQ anyway, and since it is so mobile, it is always with me. So why not use it.

  3. I know that translation is not the same as speaking. And I know that there is often no exact translation from one language to another. But, that is kind of what I like about this method. I will just be trying to find a way to say the same basic ideas with the language that I do posses. Apps and textbooks give just one possible answer for a translation. As we all known there are multiple ways to say anything in most languages. I would submit my writing on writing forums like LingQ’s writing exchange or Italki’s exchanges to get feedback from native speakers as to whether they are comprehensible.

  4. I know that I could just practice writing on my own without the LingQ exercises, or anything else, as a source. But whenever I try to do that I find that either 1) I can’t think of anything to say, or 2) I end up limiting myself to saying things that utilize the language that I am already good at producing. I don’t end up pushing myself. With the LingQ exercises I feel like I would be able balance pushing myself yet also having to use language that is practical from the beginning.

Wow, long post, I know. But something that has been rolling around in my head for a couple weeks now and writing helps me clarify my ideas. Thanks to anyone who slogs through this and shares their thoughts.

2

Sounds good. This is an example of “learning by translating”, a topic that has already been discussed in the forum. It is also what the “Assimil” method advices in order to activate your knowledge. I’m sure it’ll help you as long as it is something you enjoy enough that you can stick to it. Notice that the goal here is to activate part of your passive knowledge. That will certainly help you get rid of the feeling that you can’t “say even the most basic things”.
If it serves you as an example. When I was learning English and French, long long time ago, I didn’t have any access to native speakers to practice with. I mostly did “input based learning” through reading novels and listening to short-wave radio and I did exercises as you have decided to try to practice my output. Sometimes I did systematic translation as you plan but most often I thought about different topics and tried to find out how I could talk about them in my target languages. When I finally had the chance to travel to countries speaking my target languages, I could communicate rather well.

3

Thanks for the feedback @ftornay. It sounds like your experience was almost identical to mine. I think you put it perfectly, what I am really trying to do is activate my passive knowledge. I have heard of the Assimil method but I was unaware that it was a translation based approach. I am glad to see that you have done this and had success. Makes me feel like it is a worthwhile path.

4

I’m glad it helped.
Assimil works on the principle of the “two waves”: you go through the lessons, just reading (aloud), listening and so on. When you get past half of the book, you’re asked to keep pushing this first (passive) wave to the end, but at the same time everyday you review a lesson from the first half and try to translate back from your mother tongue to your target language. You keep going through this second (active) wave until you finish all lessons. You may want to replicate this on Lingq: read/listen to a new, challenging text and then translate an easier lesson from English to Spanish.
Of course, you still want to practice conversation or, even better, get immersed in your target language at some point. But I’m sure you can make a lot of progress in your active vocabulary through this method.

5

That’s interesting. Yes, that is pretty much exactly what I had in mind. I have worked through LingQ Lessons in my target language in the Beginner 1 and 2, and Intermediate 1 levels. I am currently working on lessons in the Intermediate 2, so I guess you could say I am half way through the “first wave” of passive learning.

I plan to continue working through these into the advanced lessons while meanwhile also going back to the Beginner 1 lessons in my Native Language, translating them into my Target Language and working to progress to more challenging ones in my second “active” wave.

Here I thought I had an original idea. Turns out I was just stealing Assimil’s method all along! Always standing on the shoulders of giants.