LingQ should add more levels

That would be really fun if LingQ added some more levels/ribbons that we can shoot for!

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I mean I’m guessing that the levels are based loosely on those established by the common European framework for language grading, which typically consists of A1/Lower Beginner 1, A2/Upper Beginner, B1/Lower Intermediate 1, B2/Upper Intermediate, C1/Lower Advanced and C2/Upper Advanced and so forth. Anything beyond that is negligible since even native speakers are still discovering new words in their own language and no two people will ever have the same experience.

More levels than what? LingQ currently has Advanced 3 and Advanced 4 levels you can reach – not sure what the max is. It’s just that few people go that far. Once you go beyond Advanced 2, there is a law of diminishing returns that kicks in as less and less words are unknown. There are students here who keep going to 100,000K known words, I’m not sure what advanced level that puts you in.

I think the current level system is just fine.

There’s advanced 3 and 4?? How do you see that?

I think you have to reach them to see them. I’ve never actually gotten that far – I switched to reading on Kindle at 50K German words, which is my highest count. But I’m pretty sure it you get an Advanced 3 and 4 badge at some word counts.

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I don’t think those levels are based on the European framework. It would be cool if they did but I don’t think so.

I never watch them to be honest because I follow my own target but looking at those levels now I should be Advanced 1 in German. And I feel I’m merely A1/A2 in a mix of reading, listening, writing and speaking.

Yes, it’s tricky to understand it only from a reading point of view and on the type of words you know. But I think the “certificates” that LingQ proposes are too generous.

But I admit it’s not an easy calculation at all.

Agreed. To me, it seems like LingQ’s levels actually line up something like this:

Beginner 2 (1500-1800) → A1
Intermediate 1 (6000-7300) → A2
Intermediate 2 (12000-14550) → B1
Advanced 2 (30250-35550) → B2

At least, that’s how I feel my level has progressed based on my roughly 12k known words in Italian.

And this obviously also may vary from skill to skill, depending on how easily you can utilize all of your known words in different skills and contexts. For example, I feel like my reading comprehension is easily a B1, whereas my ability to speak is probably A2, starting to creep up to B1.

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I actually did an experiment once comparing LingQ levels with CEFR comprehension tests: I posted my findings in this post: My New Experiment Comparing Lingq Levels Vs. Cefr Tests -...

TLDR: LingQ levels actually have a decent correspondence with the minimum levels of comprehension you’d need for the corresponding CEFR test. exp: Intermediate 2 / B2, Advanced 2/C2 etc.

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This is a very interesting test, thanks for the link.

I’ve just checked the system and it says that Advanced 2 is 30K. This is kind of in line with what I posted before about those 253 videos with 32k needed words for full comprehension. Although I target 50k.

BUT this could also give an idea that a person could potentially reach a certain LingQ level and then switch to listening, writing and speaking with those words. Without aiming to add much more.

Let’s say as an extreme scenario that instead of keep reading, once reached a certain target, the person could go for 0% blue words on a large Youtube videos course and keep listening the entire package for maximum comprehension.

Then writing - speaking. I have a different methodology for learning “at home” right now. But you get the point. Awesome!

Yes, this may very a lot because we don’t train all aspect of the language at the same time and it’s right to do this way. At least for what I’ve been learning now. Imho.

Although, I would suggest to read @t_harangi post below and to check his link. I think it’s very interesting.

And in fact, it goes along with the other post I wrote few days back and even forgot: https://www.lingq.com/en/community/forum/open-forum/how-many-words-do-we-need-to-b

I’ve actually shown that with a course of 253 Youtube random videos, the words needed were only 32k.

So, thinking about it, if you train those words on listening and eventually writing / speaking, you are definitely going to be C2 if you’re able to understand 253 random Youtube videos. Imho.

You should actually able to see that, if there is an Advanced 3 for you.

In your profile there is a level bar that it’s telling you how many words you need to reach the next level. I need 9200 to reach Advanced 2 in German. It’s positioned differently on the 4.0 or 5.0 beta version but there is in both. If you don’t see one it means that probably there isn’t one. You can check in your other languages if there is for them.

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Click on your avatar icon under your profile and then click on the visit store button. That’s how I can see my current level which is advanced 4

@rhess —That seems fine to me based on the understanding of the text even in a language like German. Advanced 2 seems to me like B2. That’s why some learners keep going and shooting for 5=6 million words read.

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I would tend to agree with this, but only for input. When you’re reading or listening, context allows you to guess a lot of the words you don’t know, and knowing every single word isn’t necessary to understand something. However, for output, you don’t get such a shortcut, so your known words level will need to be significantly higher to account for needing to know every word you produce.

If I’m understanding your post correctly, it seems you acknowledge that as well. I was surprised to see that Advanced 2 was enough to pass the German C2 exam - I thought even with being Advanced 2, the C2 would be much harder, considering the steep drop-off in vocabulary frequency. I guess that goes to show just how many words 30k really is, and how much making inferences about words you don’t recognize has an impact on your potential level.

Oh I didn’t know there was an Advanced 3 and 4. They should make it more clear to see.

While I think words read is a better measure for ones reading level I think your numbers are a reasonable proxy for languages that are analytical or fusional. I would double the numbers for C1, and double them again for C2 so:

60500 - 71100 → C1
121000 - 142200 → C2

Though somewhere at the B2-C1 level you should be able to read without LingQ pretty comfortably.

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Apparently it’s level 11 at 107k words (9k words for the next level).

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Ha! Thanks for the tip. Apparently my avatar actually grew to Advanced 5 in German. I may have known that at some point but forgot.

Wow, you definitely know Greek! :smiley:

I don´t think there is any limit to the levels. Note that on your certificate it will state the level you have completed but on your avatar it will state the level you are on. Languages I have studied so far have something like 10,500 words between levels once you finish advanced 2 and it seems you can just keep going. I have some languages where my avatar level is 6 already and it still tells me how many known words there are to the next level. You don´t get a “ribbon” or a notification beyond completing advanced 2 though.

People can do what they like and people may like to keep using LingQ for years with the same language and reach over 100,000 known words or more, because they like the interface, like the sport of getting higher known word counts or like being able to click a word to listen to it etc. I have to echo what t_harangi has already said however, that beyond a certain point, very few words will be “unknown” except for actual names of people and places or slang from other languages and you won´t learn that much vocabulary after that point. I think for most Western-European languages you should get to a semi-fluent literacy at about the point where you finish advanced 2, a fairly fluent kind of literacy at around about 40K known words and very fluent literacy at around 60K. You can certainly switch to real books, kindle or whatever form of unassisted reading at some point from about 40-60K known words.

At what point ppl like to stop or really de-emphasize reading in LingQ is up to each individual and depends on the language. I usually do very little LingQ reading after reaching 60K known words and may move that down to between 30-40K for some languages in the future, t_harangi does it at around 40-50K if I understood him correctly. All depends.

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